10/25/06 39 W - + 18 - 17 More Apex News

As of this morning, AFD switched over to the Raleigh/Wake ECC for dispatching. Though they'll still be talking to Apex dispatchers for the most part, they'll be dispatched like the rest of the county departments.

Any idea why they dont just talk to RWCC for traffic? Will they be assigned a tac/ps channel like the other department and Apex Central will monitor that channel to handle requests. If they need mutual aid or extra help will they call Apex over the radio just have them turn around and call RWCC or can they just call RWCC direct. Anyone with the inside scoop know?
fireone - 10/25/06 - 21:48

they have been using Tac 27-29 already while also using their own “Apex Disp” talkgroup to talk to Apex Communications. As of now Apex Comms does not have the Tac channels in their radios (it’s supposed to be up within the next week), so they’ll conduct fireground ops on the Tac Channel and will switch back to the Apex Disp talkgroup for comms with the comm center. From what I understand they will be assigned to a TG just as any other dept does by locution on FD ALERT. Apex Comms basically has a CAD terminal linked to the Wake County system. Apex EMS and Cary EMS both either have or are getting ready to switch over to RWECC for dispatching as well, but from what I understand will be talking and dealing with RWECC for all comms.

clear as mud?
CFP 7021 - 10/25/06 - 22:05

Apex with mutual aid from Swift Creek was dispatched to a house fire today. Both fire departments were dispatched on Fire Alert, checked in route on Tac-37, and operated off of Tac-37, but Apex maintained communications with Apex Dispatch. For instance Apex E2 was added to the call over the Apex Fire Dispatch channel.
CFP743 - 10/26/06 - 13:45

I was on the job today, still a little confusing. Apex Comm. Center is what’s called a “remote site”. They’ll have the same equipment Raleigh has. Right now though, Apex can’t monitor Tact 36, 37 and 38. Soon that will change….
Silver - 10/26/06 - 23:38

From our need (Swift Creek) I think things worked fine. I was not able to respond, but I listened to the beginning of the incident.
Griggs - 10/27/06 - 12:27

Oh yeah, all in all the incident went great. Quick knockdown, good salvage and overhaul work, and the resident was very appreciative. Plus, the dogs in the backyard were happy too, they just wanted to play fetch the whole time!!
Silver - 10/27/06 - 16:41

On another note, what leads to a first alarm fire in Apex requiring mutual aid from Swift Creek. Arnt there like 4 more fire staions between Apex and Swift Creek like Cary 3, 4, 6 and Fairview? Any idea’s?
guest - 10/29/06 - 09:39

Great CAD system!
Guest - 10/29/06 - 17:11

It might not be the CAD system. It might be the way that Apex has it set up. There are some hiccups sometimes with CAD, but it is not the complete devil. I would venture to say that most of these response groups that we hear dispatched are how the county chiefs wanted it. I believe that they get to choose who they want CAD to dispatch, and the other part is closest unit.
GFDLT1 - 10/29/06 - 18:26

Well, Cary isn’t on the system yet, are they? That would explain Swift Creek going on the alarm, they are the closest county station to where the fire was.
Silver - 10/29/06 - 22:19

The Raleigh CAD does not see the Cary FD units, therefore they would not be recommended for Dispatch. GFDLT1 is correct in that individual agencies establish the exact resources they prefer, based upon call type, for mutual aide dispatch. If you want a tanker, it will pick the closest tanker-capable resource from another agency and add it to the recommendation for dispatch.
Jon Olson - 10/29/06 - 23:02

Cary must be on the run card somewhere seeing how they get dispatched all to Apex on a regular basis, why sometimes but not this time? It does sound like a CAD issue.
guest - 10/30/06 - 11:11

Run cards are based on incident type then units are selected by attributes requested by closed station/Chief. The actual units picked by CAD are the units in-service at the time that fits those needed attributes. Departments get to choose the attributes to respond, but not the unit.

One example is in Swift Creek when the call type is an accident with injuries; we request one engine and one unit with extrication. Normally that is filled with our E-1 and T-1, but if our truck in not available (on another call, or out of service) we get the next closest unit with extrication capabilities (that the CAD system is aware of).

With the addition of Apex in the county CAD, there will surely be some things to adjust as time goes along. If we look back, we all had some growing pains when we switched to the new CAD system and a lot of them have been ironed out. Adding Apex (and Holly Springs) to the family of CAD will cause a few more growing pains but we can make it work.
Griggs - 10/30/06 - 13:53

The reason that Cary FD gets dispatched alot with Apex, has nothing to do with the CAD, it is an automatic aid agreement with Cary. Apex calls Cary Central on Tri-Com to request Cary FD and vice versa. It also goes the same way with Cary Central and Raleigh, as well as Durham Co, RDU, Johnston Co. If you go to Tri-com (Tri-Net on some radios) you will hear all of these jurisdictions talk to each other ALL DAY requesting mutual aid. However I am not completely sure how it will work with Raleigh now dispatching Apex, but I imagine it will continue to work in the same manner that it has been.
Wayne - 10/30/06 - 17:44

As a side note: Tri-Com (or Tri-Net) is now on the Wake County System/Viper System…Trunktracker ID of 19824 or Motorola ID of 801239. So now it is crosspatched from Cary system to the Wake County system.
Marshall Sherard CFP[714] (Email) (Web Site) - 10/31/06 - 01:10

That explains why is does not sound clear anymore.
Guest - 10/31/06 - 07:38

Cary will soon be replacing county departments as far as mutual aid goes for AFD... the days of Swift Creek and Fairview driving past CFD stations to run with Apex are soon to be over. This applies to hydranted areas… the rural district will still get tankers from the closest county station.
guest - 10/31/06 - 19:41

^ otherwise known as true closest station response. It’s almost here in Wake County and from what has been understood is that Raleigh FD will also be on board (or already is and just waiting for CAD programming). What is yet to be seen is if a call that is closer to a county station but within city limits gets a county unit dispatched as well as the given city unit, or if it just applies to the cities going into the county.

Just in the past 2 days there have been 2 calls that both Cary and a full county assignment have been dispatched to. Last night a wreck at N. Harrision and Reedy Creek and then today a wreck at High House and Davis.

The one at N. Harrison and Reedy Creek shows on the map that it is in the county, but both Cary FD and Western Wake FD’s went, and neither knew the other was coming. The one at Davis and High House shows the line right through the middle of the intersection. Cary FD already had a full assignment on scene and then Apex R-1 and Morrisville with an Engine was dispatched. Only after RWECC called Cary to give them the call (assuming for an EMS truck) did the two realize that there were multiple fire units dispatched. The system ain’t perfect yet folks, but hope is there that remote cad stations might be placed in Cary and RWECC to allow instant access to calls and unit status.

Maybe a single point dispatching center would work better kind of like what Apex/Holly Springs are doing now with RWECC, maybe if the CFD units were on the same CAD system with the rest of the county and dispatched by the locution (even if it’s on a separate channel like RFD) and then all communication was done with Cary Central, and a remote CAD terminal was used, this closest unit thing might just work as intended. But with Cary spending a couple million $$$ in the next year to upgrade their CAD and radio system I wouldn’t expect to see it happen like that. Who knows maybe one day!
CFP 7021 - 10/31/06 - 20:21

For those of you who haven’t heard about Tri-Com…it is a blast to listen too. Especially when you are on call and can get on the rig before the tones hit because you heard Cary asking for Western Wake’s help. Glad it is on the Wake system now as Cary’s signal doesn’t reach very far into Raleigh.
CFP743 - 11/01/06 - 09:09

^ btw it was Rescue 4 on that W/F the other night, not Rescue 2

Or you could just listen to CFD dispatch an know about it before they get on Tri-Com
CFP 7021 - 11/01/06 - 12:37

Sorry I picked up a little late, but thought I’d post just a few comments. 1) I, too, heard Swift Creek go with Apex the other day and wondered what was going on, but upon checking, found that Swift Creek was indeed closer than Fairview (via Tryon Rd to US 64). Sometimes the system does work. 2) We’re working with Apex regarding CAD setup and will continue to refine it to get it better. Most of us have been on this system 3 years now (can you believe it?), but Apex is definitely the new dept on the block. 3) Remote CAD workstations, such as Apex and Holly Springs, will definitely help elminate some of the duplication caused by multiple centers. Using the same system, allows the different centers to see what’s going on in the other jurisdictions. 4) And lastly, the number and type of apparatus dispatched is as requested by the respective departments. Sam is right, CAD doesn’t recommend a particular vehicle, it recommends vehicle based upon their capabilities. Sometimes a particular capability can be found in a closer station (than would procedurally respond) and it gets recommended, because it fits the need. It’s a complicated system, no doubt.
Chris Perry - 11/02/06 - 09:56

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